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About last night ...
posted by Mike Boone at 22h43 EST on Nov 21
It's pretty simple with Detroit's PP. They get the puck back to the point for blasts by Brad Stuart (who had 10 SoG for the game ... unreal for a Dman) and stick a big body in the crease.
Let's hope Max Pacioretty and Guillaume Latendresse were watching Tomas Holmstrom closely last night.
This is the kind of game power forwards have to play in the NHL: drive the net and make life miserable for the opposing D and goaltender.
Who did that job on the Canadiens' ONE power play last night?
Glen Metropolit.
Does no one else have the cojones for it?
Jacques Martin said the Canadiens played Detroit fairly even 5-on-5. He lauded his team's character in coming back from 2-0.
And the coach liked his new line combination.
Tomas Plekanec, Mike Cammalleri and Andrei Kostitsyn brought a dead building to life nine seconds into the third period.
It seemed like they were out every second shift through the final 20 minutes. And they made good things happen.
I think the line is a keeper. With Brian Gionta and now Scott Gomez on the shelf, Martin needs scorers – and these three have obvious chemistry.
AK46 has played with Pleks on many nights this season, but the addition of Cammalleri has finally brought the big lug out of his coma. Kostitsyn is skating, hitting, firing off that deadly wrister and, tonight, making tape to tape passes to Cammalleri for one-timers.
The 3M line had its moments, as did Max Lapierre centring Tom Pyatt and Ryan White.
The fourth line was BGL, whose 4:47 ToI was less than his PiM; Kyle Chipchura and poor, lost Gui!, who played a pathetic 5:42.
Is it humanly possible to be worse skaters than those three? They're too slow for golf.
Detroit had 34 SoG. The Canadiens blocked 29 and another 21 missed the net.
The corresponding Habs' numbers were 18-8-17.
Detroit passes the puck efficiently, they crowd the net and they shoot from everywhere.
The Red Wings are an elite team – and the Canadiens, fresh on the heels of a surprising win in Washington, played them even for the first 10 minutes of the game and might have taken them but for that penalty parade in the latter part of the first period.
Detroit had two power-play goals, but the PK guys worked their asses off.
Props to Pleks, Metro, Josh Gorges, Paul Mara, Roman Hamrlik, Jaro Spacek, Travis Moen, Ryan O'Byrne, Max Lapierre, Ryan White and Tom Pyatt.
And props to Carey Price, who was under constant bombardment. Brad Stuart's long shot looked stoppable, but the Datsyuk goal was a beauty.
Arpon Basu, who does the excellent Daily Hab-it, ran up some numbers: Carey Price stopping 64 of 68 shots over two games while his teammates managed only 40 shots in the two games combined. That makes it five straight games where Price has allowed two goals, and he is 4-2-1 with a .941 save percentage and 1.94 goals against average over his last seven outings.
Price gave up his first two shootout goals of the season, but he's been superb – and has to be, because the banged-up Canadiens are surrendering a lot of shots.
Datsyuk had six shots on goal and went 13-3 in the faceoff circle. What a player! And he's 19 for 37 in shootouts.
PK work, especially against a puck-possession team like Detroit, is exhausting. It's a tribute to the Canadiens' grit that they were able to summon the energy for a third-period comeback.
Not a bad week, as Martin said. His team took five of a possible six points, while the parade to the injury list continued.
Day off on Sunday, then a tough part of the schedule continues with Columbus – yes, they're good now – here on Tuesday, preceding a Wednesday visit to Pittsburgh and a Saturday home date with Alexander Ovechkin.
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Mike:
Sorry we left Hurley's apparently just before you were there, on Saturday night, (Sunday morning). (I hear we also missed Bob Gainey and also three of the Detroit players who stopped by for an "after the shift" refreshment.) This all happened well after our bedtime and my wife and I were probably sleeping by then, back at the hotel. The two Irish Coffees after the game helped me sleep!
I trust the Summiteers will vote Ian Cobb a vote of great thanks for his effort and stamina in getting this very well organized event together. Outstanding food, and good company (not to mention a very revealing and heartening hockey game) made this a "to do again" event on our calender.
Kudos to "The Gazette" for support and encouragement.
Boone, in your piece, what is SRO and what is MCL?
Okay - first one I get (standing room only) second one?
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This concludes our broadcast. Goodnight.
MCL = Medial Collateral Ligament
Thank you stephen!
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This concludes our broadcast. Goodnight.
Correct. I It helps, in reading About last night ..., to have practiced orthopedic surgery for a while.
Cheers Boone! And all the best to the summiteers. Wish I could have joined you - next year...
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This concludes our broadcast. Goodnight.
Does anyone know what happened to Michel Lacroix last night? He was noticably absent for the last two periods.
I'm fairly certain he was absent all night, as I recall being irked by the unfamiliar PA voice during the introductions.
s - I think you are correct.
The chink in The System's armor has been discovered: the stupidity of Laraque!
Never like waking up on a Sunday with the bitter taste of a loss, but last night felt more like a veiled victory of sorts.
We can whinge all we like about the dead weight on the team, but there is also a collection of players that shows the heart and determination that makes it possible to come back against one of the most defensively sound teams in the league. Definitely a victory in my book.
Kostitsyn has been given a shot of confidence and it shows. He's like a freight train when he's on. He has a bullet of a shot, but could use a bit more time at the range. Still too many misses.
I believe we are starting to see the emergence of Pacioretty as the driving force he will become. The next time someone erroneously bestows Latendresse with the title of power forward, refer them to Pacioretty's game. He has a powerful stride, plays the body with power (though not always coming out on the right end), and has a powerful shot. The goals might not be coming regularly for MaxPac at the moment, but he is making good things happen and creating chances.
It really does pain me to say it, but the one word that comes to mind when thinking of Lapierre's shifts is 'inconsequential'. And if you're an inconsequential agitator, you might as well not be out there. I don't know if he's confused about his role, but we've seen so much better from him in the past. Would love to see him get back to being 'invaluable'...
As for our friend Georges, his knee on Kronwall was largely due to his complete lack of mobility. Once he decides on a track, there is no switching. When Kronwall dodged the other way, Georges' wheels were still stuck in their line. I'm not excusing the hit at all, but I don't think the intent to injure was necessarily there. Suspend him three games for being an oak tree on skates.
At the end of the weekend, this squad should be really enthused and inspired by the work they put in against two of the league's top teams. I know that as a fretting fan, I certainly am.
Just want to say that it was great to attend the summit yesterday and to put a face to some of the infamous avatars! Wishing everyone a safe home and looking forward to next year!
That being said, we couldn't have asked for a more entertaining hockey game. Aside from the obvious eight-ball we put ourselves behind in the first period, I thought we skated hard and played Detroit to a tie. (I iike to watch shootouts but I don't base a w/l on the result).
Roman Hamrlik has become our shutdown guy on defense. To watch him shadowing Ovy on Friday and Zetterberg last night I finally feel that he is earning his 5 mil. Coupled with Spacek, they form one of the better defensive pairs in the league.
I though OB was a little overused last night. He is just coming back from injury and looked a little gassed at times.
The emergence of Plekanec - Cammalleri - Kostitsyn was a scoring revelation. I can't believe that with all the combos we've used we haven't dialed up a winner like this one. Unfortunately, with Gio out we'll still have a void in secondary scoring. If Gomez is going to be out for any length of time, I would call up Desharnais and SK74. It would be an improvement over Laraque and Chipchura in the lineup.
It's not going to be an easy week but if we keep skating like we did last night and Friday and stay out of the box we'll be competitive. I would like to see them shoot more. Look at Detroit who put the puck at the net and good things happen (hellooooo Gui!) Carpe diem!
... from Jim Matheson's Hockey World ..... http://www.edmontonjournal.com/sports/More+Hockey+World/2252179/story.html ........ a few tidbits from his feature ..... Martin Havlat has given the Wild squat since signing that five-year deal. One goal, three points in his last 16 games and he’s an awful minus 14, and now he has a groin injury ................. Colorado Avalanche centre Paul Stastny doesn’t have a goal on the road this season, which doesn’t look good on his $6.6-million resume ................. Tampa Bay's Steve Stamkos is playing with a badly jammed wrist after he fell into the boards, and his face-off percentage has plummeted ......................................................... Now from Matheson's Archives ..... http://www.edmontonjournal.com/health/More+Hockey+World/2224713/story.html ........ a few more tidbits from his feature ..... Jaroslav Halak, probably the Slovaks’ starting Olympic goalie, will move on as a free agent in July if the Habs don’t trade him at the deadline ................ Sergei Kostitsyn was offered big dough to leave the Montreal Canadiens farm club to play for Salavat Ufa. He said nyet because he was worried Montreal might squawk so much that he couldn’t play for Belarus in the Olympics ................................... and now a great article on the retiring Brendan Shanahan ..... http://www.edmontonjournal.com/sports/Shanahan+talented+tough/2252484/story.html
halak is a RFA with arbitration rights...how is going to move in July?
- blame bias benoit brunet.
In my opinion, what we witnessed over the last two nights, both despite and because of the lack of three of Gainey's summer signings, is exactly what Gainey was hoping to construct. A team that plays with pride, that shows a great will fueled by dedicated character, and a team that plays for each other. They rally around each other, they compensate for their teammate's weaknesses and most importantly, they don't give up.
Last year's squad would have folded under these circumstances. No Markov, missing two of it's four best forwards, playing with about six or seven AHL'ers, playing two games in two nights against top tier teams, having to play from behind in both games...
Gainey knew that from a pure skill stand point he wasn't drastically improving the team. He knew he was improving it in the area that he saw as it's greatest weakness last year. He was trying to rebuild a healthy team atmosphere. The 3 points we earned this weekend are the fruits of his summer work.
I hope some people will think of this when they are crunching numbers the next time. It ain't just the stats, folks.
Have to disagree with you here, Eric. Looking at small snapshots is great, and I was pleasantly surprised to see the Habs take 5 of 6 points this week. Last year around roughly the same time, the Habs absolutely dominated a Red Wings team at the top of its game (which, by the way, this year's Red Wings are not...they are clearly sliding back to the pack as age seems to have finally caught up to them).
But on the whole season, I see absolutely no evidence of this pride you mention. This team is just as prone to long periods of crappy play as last year's was. Martin had to call a time out last night because his team, down 2-0, came out in the second period and played like they were content to run out the clock. So there's one difference...a coach that calls a time-out when it is necessary, as opposed to waiting until the point of no return has been passed.
I'm having a hard time summoning up any level of happiness with a team that is 11-11-1 while playing the schedule the Habs have had thus far. A week and a half ago, a lot of people here were yelling for a tank job, they were so disillusioned with the Habs' play.
The Habs will be fighting and clawing for everything they get, as they are doing right now. The problem with that mentality is it takes a heavy toll...you know that any mistakes you make, any soft goals you give up, any glorious scoring chances you waste could mean a loss. That was the mentality that I think caught up with the Habs last year: with Koivu and Kovalev declining and Plekanec slumping, they didn't have the talent to play poorly and win.
If I've learned anything from this year's Habs, it is that the 2009-10 Montreal Canadiens also don't have the talent to play poorly and win.
The scary thing is that they sometimes play reasonably well and still lose. The usual late November wake-up of Andrei Kostitsyn couldn't come at a better time, and Scott Gomez is also a historical slow starter. So let's hope that if those two find their form and Cammalleri, Gionta and Plekanec maintain their own good form, the Habs suddenly feature two good scoring lines once again.
Thought I would live up to my avatar this morning... ;)
Chris, thanks for the counterpoint, though I don't see much to dissuade me. Last year's game against Detroit is a good place to look at. Firstly, the Habs iced a nearly perfectly healthy team that night, Komisarek being the only notable absence. Secondly, as for Detroit being at the top of their game, they were in the middle of a 4 game stretch were they lost 3 of those games, their first mini bump. Meanwhile, the Habs were still riding their early season high. My memory also tells me your adjective choice of 'absolutely dominated' might be a little heavy handed. I remember a healthy, confident Habs team playing a very intelligent, disciplined game. Absolute domination was not what came to mind for me. But, we could quibble over that. The real point is the Habs had faced no adversity yet and were still strutting from their conference title. It was a good test, but not a gut test. Those came in January and after, and we know how that went.
You are right that it's a small snapshot, but even the larger picture shows a team playing entirely without it's best player, and losing a succession of other key players, while keeping itself in the mix. Considering how close most of their games have been, you have to admit that the presence of Markov and his 18 or 19 points would have resulted in at least 4 or 5 more points in the standings. Which would leave us pretty close to the last two years' pace, even if all the other injuries remained as they are.
By my count there are only five or six sure fire playoff teams we face in the next 21 games. While we've faced 8 or 9 in our first 23. As I said weeks ago, if we can get to game 40 with 44 points. I am not moaning. Any better and we are well placed for a strong, hopefully healthy finish. That would require 21 points in the next 17 games. 9-4-3 would do it. Can they do it? We'll see. It won't be easy with the pieces they are missing, but if Price, a member of the team, can maintain his performance during that stretch, it's not that long of a shot. Would I prefer them to be heading into the second half in a stronger position? Sure, but there are some benefits to this path. Momentum being the most obvious.
At this point I've seen enough of this team to say this; barring some unforeseen calamity of grand scale, if this team makes the playoffs with most of it's top players healthy, they will not go down in four games quietly. They will battle and push and give hope for the future. Will they win a round? I don't know, depends on who they play and how the bounces go, but I am willing to bet they don't get booed off the ice by a large portion of the crowd. Then again, betting on the Bell Centre crowd being appreciate and realistic these days, is not money well placed.
I guess I take umbrage with the "playing with pride" point...I just haven't seen any evidence of a greater camraderie or team spirit this year. In many respects, I see a lot of similarities with last year's team. I have never bought that last year's team lacked pride...players don't lose their pride overnight. They lose their speed, they lose their confidence, they sometimes lose their health overnight...but a person's fundamental personality just doesn't change on a dime like that. A team that was largely hailed for their character and battling attitude in 2007-08 is now perceived as a team that was devoid of leadership, character and pride just one year later. I don't get it.
Fair enough, the actual pride angle is the hardest to pin down. But, in my first point I didn't exactly overstate that aspect. It's more the sense of group undertaking, team and playing for each other. I am left wondering if any sense of pride over the previous two years was more an individual, or more accurately, subset pride. There certainly was a sense of splintering last year.
it's history now but, having two of your top players, for the most part, not acknowledging each others existence in interviews is not a good sign. In bands, tension between leaders sometimes produces some great music('07-'08 team, Beatles, Velvet Underground, Husker Du, Dinosaur Jr., Uncle Tupelo) but tend to be difficult to sustain('08-'09 team, see previous list). This kind of tension is far more unbearable in the context of a team sport like hockey.
Can you imagine Gomez, Camalleri or Gionta uniformly not recognizing each others contributions in post-game remarks? I can't.
So many of us complained last season about all that talent but the totally discouraging lack of heart. This year's bunch wants to win. They may not have the same talent level but (as Tis Himself alludes to below) they thrive on close, low scoring games. I like 'em.
They have just as much, if not more talent. Injuries.
Another point of interest, I hope, inspired by the excellent post above. The group of AHLers is getting interesting. Chipchura, Pacioretty, Bergeron, White and Pyatt may be AHLers, but they are less lost in the bigs than Dags, Pacioretty and Weber were earlier on. White and Pyatt show especially good development in their games, and don't look lost out there. They are depth players, but reasonable ones. Pacioretty may be ,learning in the bigs, and may have the character not to have been too far set back by being rushed. It's looking interesting.
I would like to see someone turn into Guy Lafleur, but having someone become like Mike McPhee wouldn't hurt either.
as usual great post twocents.
very insightful and you hit the nail right over the head.
too bad other people here, don't see it the same way as you.
--- we need a kovalev
Kovalev [ka-va-leov]: A player who makes you jump out of your seat with a wicked deke or a sick shot and makes you say: "Did you see that!!"
The injury misfortunes that have beset this time, I believe, are also helping the Habs goaltenders progress, especially Price. Right now, he and Halak, have the luxury of being what Ken Dryden called in The Game "good bad team goalies." The depleted ranks on D and up front are allowing him to play much looser and relaxed than if the whole squad were healthy. And, he is giving this team a chance to win against better squads. The last two games were excellent examples of the "two-goal" rule. If the goaltender can hold the opposition to two goals or less, the burden is on the offense to carry the game. They did against the Caps and came damned close against the Wings. It also seems that the perceived gap in how the team plays in front of Price and Halak has closed.
That's a good point. Price is certainly playing a lot looser.
Eric - You could be on the right track or at least pretty close.
In recent years, we've had three guys come up from the minors whose play in their first year was inspired. You could see they were giving everything they had to stay in the NHL. They were Ryder, Pleks and Latendresse. All three have faced giant off years - an interesting thing they've had in common.
Pleks has recovered from last year, Ryder's elsewhere having a slow start but as an established scorer, and Lats has hit his own personal run of being the Samsonov luggage on the team. Bear with the guy. Yes, he is terrible this season. Yes, he seems incapable of playing the role the entire planet expects of him. Yes, he has dropped on the depth chart of a club with little depth. He's a player hurt by the CBA because time in the AHL might turn him around more quickly.
He's a frustrating player, and he's a francophone so a lot of guys gun for him anyway, but very few of the "descent into suckitude" players stay down there. Lapierre will be back. AK is coming around quickly. O'Byrne was dreadful last year, but seems capable this one. Latendresse should come back at some time this season. As fans, we watch every game like we live it, and every moment counts. In the long term, I wouldn't give up on Gui. Like Sergei, he's a work in progress. He's still young.
We have a weird process developing in front of us, as elements on this rag-tag team begin to slot in. 2 of our 4 forwards are out. Ak is stepping up. Pacioretty looks less lost out there. Metropolit is going on all cylinders, and Pyatt and White are surprisingly consistently - they are skilled and well-trained pluggers. Spacek and Hamrlik are outstanding in their role - more than anyone bargained for from them. The goaltending seems to have stabilized, and Price is not only stopping pucks but his body language has that intangible life to it he lacked earlier - the same life Gui seems to lack.
Bergeron is god-awful, but his job is to protect Subban and Weber from an early call-up, and he's doing that.
Since the Habs don't read us anyway, we can rag on players all we want, but let's not all go Timo on the young players.
I think Lapierre will bounce back but can't say the same for La-useless.
Gui is a mediocre 4th liner that would not even get a 2nd look by any other team in the league.
You either have it or you don't and I don't think Gui will ever get it, no matter how much time he's given to develop.
We've got much better 4th liners waiting in the wings.
Lats is just saving himself for the day Quebec is back in the NHL. Only then will he fulfill his destiny!
I think he has it but he doesn't get it. It's a brain thing, not a physical thing.
I gotta disagree. Lats has scored a decent amount of goals in his career up until now, given his ice time.
I guarantee if he was ever put on waivers, he would be snatched up very quickly.
Go Habs Go!! "I can't hear what Jeremy (Roenick) is saying because my Stanley Cup rings are in my ears" - Patrick Roy
I say send him down.... if he can't clear waivers, well then he's someone else's problem. We have prospects proving they belong more than he does.... and don't forget about Sergie.
Latendresse, too slow for golf! Ain't it the friggin' truth! Laraque played like a bonehead but is that really "losing a fight"? No punches, the other guy falls over on you, it's over and no one is hurt. If that's all that happens when you lose a fight, I'm willing to drop the gloves with anyone. I'm liking what I see from Tom Pyatt. Except for the first period, I thought we played decently and had a chance to win. Sure would be nice to get some scoring. I really would have looked at Shanahan. If he was still willing and able to stand in front of the net with his stick on the ice, he'd be an improvement over what we have. Go Habs!
Ok, guys....who, in their wildest dreams thought the Habs would get 3 points this weekend? I consider myself one of the most optimistic people on this site, and I had them pegged for zero.
Washington is one of the best teams in the East...although they haven't been playing like it lately, and Detroit is...well, Detroit. The fact that we got 3, and could have gotten 4 if not for the dumb penalties...and yes...dumb, even though Timo liked that knee?!? Come on....that was not sending any sort of toughness message whatsoever. You don't have to be big, strong, or tough to stick out your knee. I would have been happier if BGL picked a fight, but the knee was plain dumb, if it was intentional. I tend to think it was reactionary and he just did it to slow the guy down wiithout really thinking, but either way, it hurt the team badly.
Kinda funny, in a way, that our worst players are Francophone. With all the media & fan hype that we need francophone players, I just wish we had a couple good ones right now. I'm a Laps & Lats fan, but where the hell are these guys this year? I think we'd have 6-8 more points if they were just playing decent hockey.
Thank the Lord that BG signed Moen, and picked up Metro. These guys are really good secondary players. AK46 has landed. I think he, Pleks and Cammy are going to get to know each other real well.
I'm actually starting to feel that Pleks might make a good Captain. He seems to genuinely care about the team, and we all see he shows it on the ice. He's at least a little more vocal than Saku, and the players seem to respect him. I'd offer him 5 years and the C....I think.
We're on pace right now for about 90 points or so, which isn't enough, but if we keep improving, I think we can get around 98-100.
It's getting fun to watch our Habs again.
Go Habs Go!! "I can't hear what Jeremy (Roenick) is saying because my Stanley Cup rings are in my ears" - Patrick Roy
Good post. I usually find you a little over-optimistic, but since I'm starting to feel cautiously optimistic myself, that's OK. Like you, I thought we'd get 0 points this weekend. A couple of weeks ago, we looked as though we couldn"t compete with the elite teams and could only beat middle-of-the-pack teams in overtime. That's starting to change. We've held our own against two elite teams back-to-back, last night with two-thirds of our big little three missing.
It's ironic about our francophone players. Even RDS is starting to cool off about them. I'm not going to criticize Bergeron, who has been put in a position he's not really equipped for and who gets enough hate from just about everyone; ditto for Laraque. But Lats and Laps are quickly playing themselves down Jacques Martin's depth chart. What has happened to Laps' speed and grittiness this year? He used to be one of our most effective penalty-killers and great at digging the puck out of the corners; now he's mostly invisible. Latendresse still does good things sometimes, but overall he's ineffective. Both White and Pyatt look better than these two.
The test will be staying around .500 through the brutal month of December, especially if Gionta is out for most of it. And we missed Scott Gomez last night; I just hope the fact he was a game-time decision meant the injury is not serious. O'Byrne's return helps our beleaguered defense, but it's hard to see how Hamrlik and Spacek will not become exhausted over the next month.
I thought we'd get all four. Really.
A really gutsy performance last night. Six first-period penalties, down 2 goals against an elite team, but our guys did not quit, as last year's team very likely would have. Too bad the overtime magic came to an end. Is it possible that the famous 20-game gelling period was actually spot on? We have 5 of a possible 6 points since then, our goaltending has been excellent, and when Gionta and Gomez return, we might possibly have two scoring lines. Andrei Kostitsyn has looked better each game for the last half-dozen, and Max Pacioretty is starting to look as though he belongs out there. He still makes questionable decisions sometimes, but he's not a step behind the play like he used to be, he's fast, and he's playing with a lot more confidence. The defense has really solidified, and even the much-maligned Bergeron did not make any egregious errors last night. I almost dare to think that we are becoming a quite good team, and when we get Gomez, Gionta and especially Markov back, we'll be a very good team. Meanwhile Martin needs to keep AK46, Pleks and Cammy together; they're bringing back memories of Plecky, Kosty and Kovy two years ago - an exciting, dynamic line that makes things happen.
I'm not defending Laraque's knee on Kronwall, but I don't think he's as bad a player as many suggest. He's useful at checking and hanging onto the puck and might be effective parked in front of the net, since Latendresse won't go there.
You had me nodding in agreement .... right up to the Laraque part.
Another aside. since the Atlanta game (wasn't that the night of the Walsh twitter nonsense?) Price has gone 4-2-1 with a 1.93 GAA and .941 save% over the 7 starts that shall define his month of November (another Molson Cup for November coming to go along with the October one I would imagine)
Oddly, the kid's had 2 less than stellar starts in 15 tries now (Vancouver and Atlanta) in the other 13 starts, he's not been scored on more than 3 times a single time and several times he's faced more rubber than a dead raccoon on the 401.
Almost time for the media clowns and some of the more stubborn Price bashers to give the kid a break already and stop the, 'Ya but he needs to play like this for a few starts before I start to buy it' B.S. already.
Hell, his stats for all starts not including the Vancouver/Atlanta games have him at a 2.25 GAA, and a .930 save% over the other 13 starts for crying out loud. Those numbers come out of any other goalie on any other team and all of the people bashing on our goalie (including Halak's agent) are singing his praises. Let alone a goalie that's only barely 22 yrs old and already has 2 major championships and 2 MVP awards in those championships under his belt. Aye Carumba, Bob better find a way to sign this kid and Plekanec before they lose both of them and fall behind even the Leafs.
....and nahlsy is in love again. Congrats, man! Just want to point out that if we took out all of Patrick Roy's good games, he has terrible stats...conversely, if we only count Red Light Racicot's good games. he was the best goalie ever stats wise. See where I'm going with this? Your smugnes is funny, though, so keep it up.
Price is playing like he is capable of though, and it's nice to see. He was weak for a long time. Really needed a stretch like this. Hope he can keep it up.
You are F_cking Clueless Clay.....
Clay 4 - I actually don't get where you're going. I mean, you are going after nahlsy and may inspire another potty mouthed rant from him, so maybe that's all you're doing. But if you have a point, could you please elaborate it? A guy with such a good avatar must have something clear to bring - this bully and rant show is getting tiresome from both sides.
I sunk to it's level last night and got it out of my system after listening to the constant garbage for the first two months. I'd let them ruin too many Saturday nights this season and couldn't sit quietly anymore so I responded to it. I am back to being a mature adult again that wishes there were moderators that would remove certain trolls that are hell bent on the chronic harrassment of other posters but, have accepted that it apparently won't happen.
I think mr Boone puts a lot of effort and pride into these blogs and I find it to be completely disrespectful that certain posters go out of their way to try to create chaos and fights amongst their fellow posters and take joy in doing so. I wish for mr Boone's sake that they would stop trying to ruin these boards with this nonsense but, it's obvious that certain individuals aren't ever going to let it go. There's no "ignore" or "mute" function, the select few posters have apparently refused my repeated requests to not have any interaction with each other to create a mutual truce, and the moderators won't clean up the trash when they do go out of their way to try to pick a fight (such as above) so I guess I'll just have to ignore the trash out of respect for mr Boone and my fellow posters that don't care to have to read it, since there's clearly no reasoning with the chronic offenders, who refuse to stop the harrassment.
Hi CHFan! Glad you like the avatar...hoping we get another 50 goal man sometime (fingers crossed for Cammy!). My point was that if you take any goalie's bad games out, he will look great, and poor goalies will look great if you discount their poor games. It is pointless to list stats "taking out the 2 bad games", to try to make a point about how great (or not) someone is.
As for bully, not I sir...I responded this way as a reply to his third paragraph, which, if you know the history, is a jab and myself and 2 other posters (who I will leave out of this)... I admit to having a certain disdain (to put it mildly) for him - inspired by his excessive name-calling, and then playing the victim - but I have never resorted to outright profanity and lies to make my point. I admit to being (humourously) responding to last night as well as making what I think is a valid point - and to be clear, I would make the same point to any poster who claimed what he did in the post I was responding to (where he said "...his stats for all starts not including the Vancouver/Atlanta games...").
Furthermore...if you look at all of my posts, not once have I ever had an altercation with any poster other than him, and to a much lesser extent Priceberg (AKA The Rock) - and I actually like Priceberg!
Bedtime now for me - have a nice day!
50 goals in 50 games... I think I'd almost settle for a scorer that got 50 games this year.
Ah...my hopes were not so lofty - I was also just hoping for 50 goals in a season! :)
I guess some will not like this but I have no problem with what Laraque did. Lots of people here complaining about it only because its Laraque and its fashionable on here to slag him. Dont get me wrong I hate senseless violence but We been on the wrong end of cheap shots more than we give them out, in recent memory anyway. Our goalies get run over etc Other teams skate around too comfortably against us, nothing wrong with giving them something to worry about. The league isnt doing anything about cheap shots...so until I see a real (more than a handful of games) suspension for cheap shots....
I see your point.
The point is he is a useless player with no skill whatsoever, why they would dress him for any game, let alone a team like Detrot is beyond belief, and you have no problem with what he did, you need your head read. He had no reason to stick the leg out on that play, the reason he did, was he can't skate, can't turn to the left, can't pass, can't shoot...just a waste of money, but, you have no problem with that either, I suppose...see a doctor fast, you obviously don't have a clue...he's a slug with no talent at all...we have kids in the minors who would fit much better than that idiot...
Kronwall is a "live by the sword, die by the sword" kind of player. He doles out injuries and now has 1 in return. Until the NHL penalizes injurious hits with serious suspensions, this crap will continue.
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Beliveau- his legend is 600' tall and growing...
His talent lies in the physicality department. If you want to drop the gloves and take him on, I am sure you can likely sign a contract to play in his place with a victory. The guy he got is no angel by ANY stretch of the imagination and has put more than several player's share of guys into the hospital with very 'questionable' hits over the last year or so himself. I won't get into a debate on the incident itself, everyone has their own view based upon their vantage point of it all but, lat off the personal attacks. Cat doesn't share your opinion, that's no reason to be nasty and insulting about it.
Thanks for defending me, I dont seem to be allowed.
Just getting sick of the personal attacks ruining this board. If these guys want glame wars, there are other places they could take them and leave us to discuss the Habs in peace.
As an aside, how scary are Heatley and Thornton together? Heater's got 18 goals, Thornton has 25 assists right now I believe it is. S'what happens when you put one of the top 2 or 3 pure shooters in the world alongside one of the top 2 or 3 pure passers in the world. Yeouch.
It's quite effective for now, until Jumbo Joe becomes Invisible Joe in April and Heatley doesn't have anyone to feed him the puck since Marleau can't compete in the playoffs either. Hawks would tear them apart in the post-season.
- I shall always remember Captain Koivu.
The thing that hurts San jose more than Joe not showing up (although I think its overblown, ive watched him in the playoffs, he isnt that bad) is Nabokov gets outdueled by the other goalie. Last year his sv % in the playoffs was .890, the year before .907, (and SJ pretty much outshoots their opponents regularly, sometimes severely), and thats not good enough against the likes of Luongo, Turco, Kipprusoff. San Jose wins the cup this year IMO
There is one thing that is going right for the Habs - Gui! is playing 5 minutes per game as he should... well, he shouldn't be in the league, but that's another story.
I don't mind what Laraque did as much as when he did it. He should do this kind of stuff when habs are down a few and have no chance of coming back. I long wanted to see Habs do something nasty on the ice. Stick, knee, whatever... enough of that nice push-over guys crap.
Man... still, is it ever a pleasure to watch Detroit play.
I think there must have been Flyer or Laffs scouts in attendance and BGL was told to look good for them.
Franklin the Beagle, 7/1/2002-7/13/2009
totally agree - I mean why wasn't this guy throwing knees at Lucic in beantown last spring???
Code my ass
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AK46 - Plecs - SK74
BGL was pissed because he lost that "fight" (more like a "holy sh*t I'm in a fight with Laraque so I'd better just tackle him") last night...now that that's out of his system, we'll see more of his 'code'.
I couldn't watch the game tonight, but I'm really curious about Lats' performance tonight.
See, he's only played 6 minutes, which is not a lot of time for a guy to be terrible in (even though Laraque managed to do so). One must've been looking at him very closely to notice him being terrible in such a blink of an eye. And while apparently sucking out loud for less than 6 minutes, he managed to squeeze in two hits and one takeaway. But then again, Lats seemed to be scrutinized more than any player not named Price so it's possible he might have been noticed playing terrible in whatever part of that 5:50 icetime, when he wasn't hitting or taking away the puck.
You see, statistically he was one of the best goal-scorers on the team for two years running. So I'm a little perplexed that people think he doesn't belong in the league since he's so obviously proven it before -- you'd have to be pretty prejudiced not to admit that, but then again some people are when it comes to Lats. I'm really not sure why he's so much less productive now than he was before, but I can't imagine the lack of icetime is helping. Lats is not getting much of a chance to be anything but an afterthought, and honestly, he hasn't gotten much of a chance since the beginning of the season either.
I don't approve of how Martin is handling him and worry that Lats may end up being to Martin as Penner is to MacTavish, but then he resurrected Andrei so I'm willing to give him the benefit of the doubt.
For two years now, he's been talking about going to the net, using his body etc. He still won't. It's frustrating. I don't know why it's such a difficult concept to play hard and tough. He'll come out for a shift or two and do it but then disappears. I was with him until this year but not so much anymore. I'm still hoping that the penny will drop because I do think he has some ofensive upside.
Very good post. Lats have problems, but on this particular site, it's just irrational hate. You will pretty much see a negative comments everytime he's on the ice.
IMO, he is not used properly. And if he needs to go in front of the net, it's not on a 3rd or 4th line that he'll be able to do it.
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We have a new team!
Mike Komisarek: (-2)-0-(-2)
Gainey Haters bandwagon ---> This way
If he has a good game, I leave him alone. He had one with Max a little while ago and I was quite pleased. The problem is they didn't do anything to improve on themselves and keep that trend going. Latendrese and Lapierre will have a nice game, then several lousy games so they're stuck to 4th-line minutes by Jacques because he doesn't like the results he's getting.
A player's line assignment shouldn't prevent them from doing their best to score a goal, Matt Bradley in Washington barely racks up points but he top-shelfed Lundqvist on a breakaway to win the Caps/Rangers game last week. Gui wants to score goals, he should work hard regardless of his assignment. Lapierre had 15 goals last year never working above the 3rd line and often working the 4th and that was his first full NHL season, why should Gui need Top-6 time in his 4th NHL season to match that or exceed it? He has to work at scoring himself, he hasn't worked that hard otherwise he'd get more ice time. Hard work earns you top-line minutes, hence Moen and Metropolit being on the Top-6 rather than Lapierre or Latendresse, they're not earning the time.
JM challenged him to work harder, why is that a crime?
- I shall always remember Captain Koivu.
"If he has a good game, I leave him alone." It's too bad JM doesn't. He's had a never-ending revolving door of linemates and reduced minutes and posters here call him useless. Lats has accomplished more in hockey than any of these "knowledgeable" posters. But, because he's french and not Guy Lafleur, he will be constantly bashed. So will Laps. The anti-french bias on this site is growing daily.
Gui has been lazy this season plain and simple. He is choosing when to play hard and when not to, not throwing hits nearly enough and never going to the front of the net when he should with the exception of the two times he scored goals. Then he wouldn't go near the front of the net for several more games, not realising that's where he should be all the time because he doesn't understand his role. He's far too slow to play the Top-6 effectively as he won't go to the net to create traffic to make up for his lack of speed, he doesn't have good hands and he can't win a board battle nearly enough for a guy who tries to be a power forward. His wraparounds are an exercise in futility unless the goalie screws up, like when Montreal played Tampa last year but he keeps trying them, as if he's magically going to double his speed when he does it.
Gui has played under Julien, Carbonneau, Gainey on two seperate occasions and now Jacques Martin, that's 4 coaches that he hasn't worked hard for and hasn't taken any real direction from apparently, I'd say he's the problem more than any coach mistreating him.
- I shall always remember Captain Koivu.
The problem is that he's been a productive under Julien, Carbonneau, and Gainey -- one of the team's best goal-scorers, as I mentioned before. He's not being productive at all under Jacques Martin, though. We can complain all we want about what we perceives his flaws to be (and really there's some evidence he's been more effective than given credit for this season even), but the bottom line is that he used to be a good scoring forward and now he's not. Irrational Lats hate should not make one look sight of that fact, especially since he should represent a significant source of secondary scoring for the Habs. (The notion that he doesn't have good hands or can't win a board battle is pretty hilarious, but I'm used to seeing that sort of thing with regards to Latendresse.)
For the record, I'm entirely unconvinced that "he should be in front of the net all the time" is actually going to make him a better player, and the results so far don't seem to be encouraging. I'm starting to wonder if this obsession is not turning an effective player in a less effective one. If so I can see why he's confused when he's asked to drop what has led to him scoring goals in the past for something that hasn't been as effective.
He was never that productive and has never been this 25, 30 goal scorer that he's been built up to be over several seasons, he's failed to crack the 30 point barrier and this year he'll likely be outscored by Glen Metropolit and Travis Moen, because they've worked harder than he has. A good scoring forward is a 20-goal man with consistency like Higgins gave in his first three seasons, he shot the puck a lot and was a handy guy to rotate through the Top 6 or a checking line as while he wasn't that accurate, he shot constantly and scored at least 20 per season with a lot more speed than Lats can manage. Latendresse doesn't have anything close to Cammalleri's wrister and he doesn't shoot enough to make up for it by bombarding the goalie with rubber.
I see Lats go into the boards and the other guys comes out with the puck more often than he does, you may call yourself MathMan but I can count when one side's winning the battles more than the other side. Lats doesn't have good passing play and his shots generally hit the goalie's chest protector more than they come close to scoring goals when he shoots at the net. That's what I call ineffective board play and bad hands, the corners rarely work out in his favour, he doesn't pass well to set up others and he has trouble scoring himself if the net isn't wide open. I watched all his goals from last season and this one on NHL.com to see if I was wrong about his shot but honestly, those goals weren't anything like Gionta's or Cammalleri's shot.
Of Gui's goals starting from the 08-09 season to now, only 3 of them you could say were strong shots, the others came from at a maximum distance of 10 feet from the goalie crease as he would gobble up rebounds, push in loose pucks, one wrap-around that came on a weak goalie and work off perfect feeds. That's why everyone talks about his having to work the front of the net, crowd it and dig for dirty goals, that's where his scoring came from, being in front of the net and getting the puck into the net up close. He doesn't exactly let loose lasers, he gets that rebound and stuffs it in the net and I'm fine with players like that, dirty goals still count and if he got 20 or more of them a season because he always went for them, I'd have no problem.
- I shall always remember Captain Koivu.
Lats clearly has performance issues. I don't know what his problem is and I don't particularly care. I like that he has been dethroned, but then Martin gives Laraque ice time and MAB is on the ice in the last 2 minutes in a tied game. So... I can't really trust JM.
Lats has been a productive forward and isn't now. This is a serious problem that should be remedied.
I'm not sure where all the irrational hate for him comes from, but the Habs need him to be productive again.
Maybe his 'performance issues' can be cured by a little blue pill...
come Timo, 'dirty' play is not good for any team. i like a team having grit, tenacity, and guts, but not by dishing out cheapshots.
I was at the Chicago-Calgary game the other night and I have to say watching Chicago is even better than Detroit.
Incorrect, cheap shots in any game that can hurt another player's career have no business being in hockey. That's called poor sportsmanship and it shouldn't be what the Habs are about when they're in a losing situation or a winning one, Montreal has never and should never ever be some knockoff of the Broad Street Bullies.
Ryan O'Byrne beating Kaleta senseless when he hits Pyatt from behind? Yes, that's what we should get from our team, as is Lapierre laying into the guy who hit MAB from behind, stick up for your guys. Laraque doing a cheapknee-to-knee contact is something the Club should be ashamed of.
- I shall always remember Captain Koivu.
Could be that I just don't really care about these millionairs' careers. I respect your opinion though.
All I want for Christmas is a replica of Tomas Holmstrom.
Please?
Pretty please?
sob....
im happy, we played better than I expected, and the bar tried to turn the channel from the game in OT, and my girlfriend got the game back and free beers. WOOT, GO HABS and RACHEL
Early night home post-summit.
What killed us: Laraque. He was absolutely and unconditionally the worst thing about the Habs, and the fact that he played a single shift after sitting in the pen for 6 minutes is testimony to JMs EXTREME patience with some guys.
Also, Lapierre. Bad decisions, and a homebrew-and-borscht level brain fart that led to him sitting for two after clearing over the glass UNDER NO PRESSURE. I would have sat his *** for the rest of the game for that move.
Also, face offs. We lost almost all of them- at least, almost all of the ones that counted.
Also, Gui! Awful. Awful. He dumps it in, he shies away from hits, he's acting like he read a book somewhere about how to be, instead of just being. He looks all wrong in his uniform and I'm beginning to wonder if he isn't ill or depressed or there isn't some other crap in his life that is throwing him off. WOman troubles, drug troubles, troubles sleeping, who knows. I want the scrappy kid back from last year. This new Gui! sucks.
MAB was OK and was on the ice in the final couple of minutes. I think O'Byrne made a couple of noticeable bad plays but I didn't catch any by MAB. Maybe one crap clearing attempt.
AWESOMENESS: Carey. I believe. I didn't. Now, I do. Also, Kostitsyn. Why he didn't hit the ice until 3:00 into the OT, I will NEVER know. JM, build a bridge, get over it, and play this guy more. He is earning it. Cammie, of course. Hamrlik made one move that got booed in the OT- not pushing up to get a drifting puck- but it was the smart play as Spacek was pinching.
CRAP: Habs fans. Booring everything, cheering when Kronwall went down. Don't even get me started about the fight behind our section, started when a drunk fecknut threw a full beer at a guy in a Wings jersey. Booing clear Habs offsides. Missing good plays by our guys. I used to be proud of our fandom. Now, not so much.
Are you questioning JM's genius? He was hire by another genius call BG. Together they are two genius...es?
Very nice dose of sarcasm.
Not gonna bite. I'm kind of hung over and getting prepped for a fottball game.
When are you going to show up to a summit and talk smack in person? ;)
Yes, the majority of the boos were for the refs.
I was telling Chris at the game that Andrei has played maybe 1 overtime shift ALL year!
Thank you for noticing as well how little he is played in what I think is an excellent situation for him to be on, 4 on 4.
Teacher Man, I wish you hadn't pointed that out to me- it is going to bug me all year!
Great watching the game with you- and the rest of the gang!
I was at the game. The boos as I heard them were for the refs. I thought the crowd was a good one. They gave standing ovations both after the end of regulation and after the end of OT.
The team missed both Gionta and Gomez tonight.
Worse than that though was BGL. He is useless and is a liability. Trade him, waive him, release him. Just let him go!!!! He brings nothing of value to this team.
We have Gionta to take care of Chara now!!!!
Agree 100% about Laraque.
Laraque had the worst shift I've seen in a long time. One shift, one high stick, two missed checks (including one on his opposite wing- to quote JM,what the feck was he doing over there?) and then the deliberate attempt to injure on Kronwall. Brutal.
And I'm not sure about the fans- yes they gave the Habs an O for pulling off three points on back to back games against Contenders- but there was WAY too much moaning and groaning, and that fight at the end was just ridiculous. And the first reaction to the Kronwall hit was YEAH followed by incredulous boos as the second ref lifted his arm. Laraque is poison, get him gone.
how many attended the summit?
I wonder if Bob can discretely call the league and ask them to give BGL a 10 game suspension as a favour to the Habs and their fans.
...ALL of Us did the same lazy act one time or other in our competitive lives ...We stupidly stick out a leg to slow down or trip someone blowing by Us ...something We kick Ourselves later for blowing Our job on the field or ice ...happens so fast You are not 'thinking' ...only 'reacting'
...say what You want about Georges ...Our beef with Him is He does NOT WANT to hurt the people He is being paid to 'hurt' or fight 'enough' ...unless THEY 'invite' Him to hurt them ...and I guess THAT is some peoples' frustration now
...but They should NOT blow this out-of-proportion
Habitant means PASSIONATE HOCKEY
http://www.nationalpost.com/news/story.html?id=423049
sure we've all made mistakes... but we weren't getting a 1.5 million dollar salary to do it!!!
Lazy, vicious, accidental, whatever. BGL doesn't help the team and is going to be facing a buyout at the end of the season. I was simply making the point that if he was suspended for a long time and kept off the ice, it would probably help the team. If he's benched or scratched, he talks and becomes a distraction. If he's suspended, it's much less of a distraction.
I wonder if players on suspension count against the salary cap.